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Geoff Olynyk's avatar

Absolute tour de force. This one needs to get into the New York Times and should get you an interview on Ezra Klein’s show.

I am a small-L liberal (though also a large-L Liberal Party of Canada voter for most of my life) and find myself guilty of many of the behaviours you list in here, particular in wanting to simply regulate social media into nonexistence to restore the elite gatekeepers. At least in Canada we’re going to get to see if the EU and UK has any success at this before we try.

But if you’re right and that effort is doomed to failure — we have crossed a rubicon and elite gatekeeping is never coming back — then it has big implications for the entire project of social progress. I am more pessimistic than you that if the elites simply engage with the public that things can move forward.

Immigration here in Canada is a good example. Broadly speaking, Canada only had white immigration until the 1960s when, under Trudeau Sr, the modern version of race-blind points-based immigration was invented. The government and elites pushed this, to a large extent, on a more conservative population. If social media had existed it may have never happened in the first place! Except then it turned out to be an amazing success, in my opinion, the most successful multicultural immigration system in the world in terms of high immigration rates (twice as high as the United States!) while having good social integration and maintaining high public support. The elites were right, and the masses were too blind to see that it can work.

Then of course, as we know, post 2015, Trudeau Jr broke everything by spiking immigration rates too high too fast (see https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/article-how-canada-got-immigration-right-and-then-very-wrong/ ) which is a perfect example of how elites from 2012-2022 lost their minds and lost the trust of the public.

Is it “populist” that now for the first time in my life, there are active voices in Canada saying we should go back to all-white immigration? That used to be off-limits, beyond the pale, and in my opinion rightly so. (But they’re not wrong that multicultural immigration only works up to a certain rate — which the Trudeau LPC broke… so it’s more complex)

This comment has ended up somewhat muddled, so I’ll try to just summarize it here. I’m not convinced that we ever would’ve had our modern multicultural immigration system in the 1960s in the first place without elite gatekeepers and if social media had existed then. And I’m *really* worried that the Overton window is now shifting back to some really dark places — somewhat legitimately in backlash to the excesses of the “woke” Trudeau Liberals — but the pendulum swinging back is going to go really far without any kind of brake pedal from elite gatekeepers.

Anyway A+ essay, I’ll be sending this to people. It challenged my thinking.

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Lee Nellis's avatar

I spent many years working in collaborative processes where we tried, and sometimes succeeded, in bring divergent viewpoints together. This was mostly before social media amplified the divisions, but there were people and organizations who actively promoted the extremes and sometimes tried to disrupt the process. I do not think, reflecting, that gatekeepers - liberal or otherwise - had anything resembling control of what people brought to the table, but then these were all face-to-face encounters in which lived experience held equal sway with information from "sources."

When it worked it was the kind of inquiry that John Dewey envisioned leading to a continuing community conversation, to a community that informed itself and acted on that. I suppose he believed that the extremes would be moderated, and I have seen that happen. And I think the "liberal (I hate these labels)" aversion to the fray of social media stems from knowing that it can happen and judging that it should. Having also seen the outcomes of sincere dialogue blown away by the will to power of interests who cannot accept the outcome and continue to profit as they would like, I subscribe to that "should."

Which leads me to my usual point: What "controls" is the story or myth people share about what it is we're all doing here. Social media currently exacerbate the American myths of individuality and competition (violent competition if necessary). It is the final(?) tool of imperialism, which must keep on colonizing something and, having subjugated material reality, is now colonizing the minds of those who allow that. If there has been something different to pick out of our culture, social media would, I think, reinforce that. If we don't cultivate a new guiding myth, the collapse of anything resembling democracy is inevitable.

One suggestion for starting the new myth: It must insist on face-to-interaction. Checking on your Aunt's health on Facebook, sure, and sharing pictures from your trip to the islands. Its just the new mail or phone call. But having tried both public engagement and teaching on-line, I am persuaded (with a little help from Neil Postman and others) that we are a long ways down a path we should have known better than to take.

I think the problems with this essay, which is indeed well-done - is that it accepts a false premise that effective persuasion is possible during a continuing free-for-all in which everyone is struggling to preserve their identity. It isn't There have to be widely accepted "ground rules" suggesting that agreement is the desired outcome and that compromising to attain that outcome is a desirable thing. When people work face-to-face with at least some regard for each other, the winner take all nature of American politics can be (usually has been) mitigated. That doesn't happen on-line.

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